Before you answer, read a little further:
-In our country, we have deemed 11 year olds not mature enough to decide rationally whether or not they want to have sex. So we arrest and imprison the adults who 'victimize' them.
-In our country, we have deemed 11 year olds not mature enough to decide rationally whether or not they want to fight, and possibly die, to defend our freedoms. So we forbid them from joining the military.
-In our country, we have deemed 11 year olds not mature enough to get behind the wheel of a car and drive. So we make them wait five more years before they get a driver's license.
-In our country, we have deemed 11 year olds not mature enough to responsibly ingest alcohol. So we have made it illegal for them to do so.
But apparently, 11 year-olds are mature enough to be imprisoned for the rest of their lives for a crime that they commit. I think that is a bit ridiculous.
I am not saying that is was not a heinous crime. I am not saying that this kid should be set free without some sort of punishment. I think they should have professionals evaluate whether or not he is mentally stable. If he is, he needs to put into a facility and rehabilitated, educated and monitered until he is 18 or 21. At which time, his record should be expunged or sealed and he can go on about his life.
This kid is obviously not an adult, so he should not be tried as an adult in a court of law.
Let's be reasonable people!
HIP HOP LYRIC OF THE DAY:
It's as easy as cake/simple as 'Whistling Dixie'/as I'm waving a pistol/ at 60 Christians against me/go to war with Mormon's/take a bath with the Catholics/in holy water/no wonder they try to hold me under longer
Renegade
-Eminem
14 comments:
You make some valid points but I had to laugh about the whole education, rehabilitation part...although designed for that, for so many it's not the case.
I don't think his record should be expunged...sealed, maybe, but not 100% decided. Granted spending time in a facility is a consequence, but what about the sex offender that's registered for life (even if he's only 18 and had sex with a 15 yr. old),or the 14 yr. old that became pregnant? Their youthful mistakes follow them forever. In this case two lives are gone...adult jail is not the answer but seven years in a juve facility doesn't cut it for me either. I don't really know what would; however, by 11, some idea of right and wrong should be already established.
And now that I think about it are they going to charge him with double homicide? She was eight months, same as Laci Peterson and Scott is now on death row. Our justice system is so messed up...it's a life if she's wants to keep it and not a life if she doesn't...another topic for another day :) Daria
The 18 year old who has sex with a 15 year old is an adult, mature enough to understand and comprehend the consequences of his actions and mature enough to be held accountable for them. We consider 18 year olds adults. That is the difference. And they are charging him with murder of the woman and the unborn child.
Yes, the 18 yr. junior/senior in high school is an adult and his 15 yr. old sophomore/junior girlfriend is not. So should 18 yr. olds not be in the same school system with minors....how is that different than the minors in jail?--D
At the risk being elusive, if you think an 11 year old in prison with grown men and a 15 year old in high school with 15 year olds are the same - which I'm sure you don't. But if you didn't argue the opposing view point, even if you don't believe it, then who would? - then I hope that you are never the superintendent of a prison system or director of a school district.
But since you're one of the people who's thoughts I highly respect, I'll humor you:
Schools are already adequately divided by age, which is why you have elementary schools, middle schools and high schools.
Also, schools are meant to be institutions of learning, prisons are institutions of punishment. Schools are tailored for both 15 year old and 18 year olds. Prisons are tailored for adults, not 11 year olds.
Schools are monitered by teachers and administrative staff. And for the most part, they do a good job since there is rarely much Serious violence or sex on school grounds. Can that be said for prisons? I think not.
Thanks for humoring me :)
While we both are aware schools and prisons are two different institutions, my main point is this kid committed a very serious crime and there should be very serious consequences. The 18 yr. old "adult" that still matriculates with minors on a daily basis is branded for life for a "crime" that while inappropriate is not life or death.
This kid's actions affect many people not just his own: Two lives are gone, other minors were traumatized witnessing a gruesome scene (could you imagine being the 4 yr. old child finding his mother murdered?), a father is dealing with the lose of a lover and two children (the unborn and his jailed son), two families are in shambles and this has rocked a small town.
I don't know what should be done and I'm not saying he should be locked up and thrown away without a key but there should be some weight this young man carries.
Prisons are for punishment but they are also supposedly for rehabilitation; one can only hope this young man learns and grows from this and becomes a productive citizen after he pays his debt.
The kid DID commit a very serious crime. And an 18 year old victimizing a 15 year old is also a serious crime. The difference, and the reason that the 18 year old is branded for life as opposed to the 11 year old, is that the 18 year old is old enough to be have a very clear grasp of what he is doing when he is sexing up the 15 year old and a full understanding of the consequences. An 11 year old does not. That is why one is should be branded for the rest of their life and one should not.
And I think that him being institutionalized from 11 to 21 - which is about the same amount of years that he has been on Earth - is a pretty heavy weight to carry.
Just my opinion.
And it not that I am for him only in a facility until he is 21. It is that I am categorically AGAINST him being put in prison for the rest of his life. If I were a judge, the punishment that I outlined is what I would give him. Not that it is right or wrong, just my opinion on what should happen. If you were the judge, what would you sentence this kid to?
And don't say 'I don't know.'
This is why you it should be mandatory to pass some sort of screening or test before you can be allowed to have children (I’m kinda kidding, but kinda not). My first instinct, given that this child is so young, would be to punish his parents first. Children are a product of their environment and the primary responsibility of their parents FIRST and their communities. The government should only be involved when parents/communities fail. When government does get involved, it costs every person who pays taxes. So the punishment should also take into consideration the cost of
First, let me just state that I do not believe that the penal system we have now is effective at rehabilitation. This is demonstrated by 1) recidivism rates and 2) the unequal representation of poor and minority people in the system and a whole host of other reasons. The penal system is hugely flawed to begin with.
Now, in terms of having the punishment equal the crime (short of the eye for an eye stuff in the Hamarabi code), I would be in favor of this child giving at least a significant portion of his life, be it in service or institutionalization, for the crime. Then being let free…ONLY because he is a child and it is not completely his fault. I would also be in favor of the child’s parents giving a significant portion of their lives, either in service or institutionalization, for the crime. When parents neglect their children, they get locked up or they get their kids taken away. Letting a child get to this point is similar. The parents owe a debt to society as well as the child…
Ok, I'll back off the 18 yr. old. If he were an 18 yr. old college freshman, I'd probably feel different.
And I'll even give you spending ten years in a facility is a good amount of time.
However, I still have two problems.
1)This boy was being trained to hunt; I can only assume he has hunted animals before. Hunters of any age (like farmers) have a better understanding of life and death than most. This boy knowingly open fire on a sleeping victim. He understood how the gun worked, and he understood the outcome of shooting it. Now, he might not have grasped the repercussions of going to jail and such, but that doesn't reverse the action or lessen the weight.
2) Juvenile centers and even adult prisons usually do not successfully fulfill rehabilitation services. Repeat offenders have that name for a reason. isn't your state releasing thousands for overcrowding? What have they gleamed from their sometime 2-3 hr. stay? There's something wrong with the system. How is one properly integrated back into society? It's not by putting them on a bus with $20 bucks and saying good luck.
I mainly say I don't know what I'd do because of the system. But since you're wanting a definite answer I'd sentence him to juve until 21 and then move him to an adult facility until he was 26 (age of the victim). After that I'd want there to be some kind of monitored transition program that would make the transition from prison to freedom a little easier. Not like parole but something more positive that truly helps people put there lives back together afterward. Kind of like AA to keep convicts on the wagon. Good thing I'm not a judge.
So I didn't see the other anon post before I posted my last comment. Definitely agree with parents begin held responsible as well. If only...--D
That's the thing. I don't think he had a better understanding of death at all. I mean, sure he knows that him and his father go hunting and we shoot animals. Then we take them home and hang their heads over the fireplace or eat them. But I am pretty sure that he did not have an understanding of death in in this regard, 'If I shoot this woman, she is going to die. And she is not coming back. And her unborn child will die. Her family will be devastated. My father will be devastated.'
I know it sounds far fetched, but I'd be willing to stake my reputation on the fact that he didn't have a full grasp of death really. Sure he points the gun at deer and pulls the trigger. What's the result? They die. But what is the REAL result? To him death is just a word, an empty action that goes only as far as the victim and is easily forgotten about.
I can't really explain it better than that, it being such an abstract thing.
And I think his parents being locked up for this would be a little extreme! But that is like a whole other comment entry, and once I get started, I probably won't be able to stop for a while. So I'll leave that for another day.
So that I don't forgot I want to address the parents first. That gun should have been locked in a safe place out of a child's reach, and only taken out when preparing to hunt. If the kid would have shot himself, the parents would be held for culpable negligence.
On to the kid. So, I tried to look at this from a different perspective. I bitch all the time about parents that think letting their kid fail will teach him a lesson. I say an 11 yr. old does not grasp the concept of failing until much later. I will relent this one time and say the kid might not have a grasp on death.
Unfortunately, the kid that touches a hot stove still has a burn; the kid that has unsafe sex still has a disease; the kid that plays with a gun has still killed someone. A life has been lost and there are consequences and unfortunately we have a flawed prison system that will probably not help this boy learn from his mistakes and better himself. It sucks but that's what it is. I don't think he should be imprisoned for the rest of his life but I'm still for a heavy sentence.
Just my thoughts--D
You are right. The parents SHOULD be held responsible for not keeping the safe place. When you said the parents should be held responsible, I thought you meant for the kids actions, not his accessibility to the gun.
And I agree, we do have a flawed system. And we probably will bury this kid away somewhere for him to emerge worse than he went it.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,517496,00.html
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